Tulpa.info - tulpa-discussion

I don’t think anyone should be making a tulpa if they are unable to allow their tulpa to have time to be a person outside of their headspace. They should not be confined to only talking to you. Also tulpas really massively grow into their own person once they are able to regularly interact with people outside their system and create their own experiences. Until that happens they are limited to speaking about the things their host did which is just really frustrating to them

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Fair enough, but you did call it iffy and questionable

i don't think there is anything wrong with keeping tulpa just in your mind, a lot of people have tulpas that are not interestedi n the real world in my opinion it's just quicker for personality and tastes development when you let them interact with other people humans are social animals and we use other people as mirrors from which we learn about ourselves

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1:00 AM

i think you are projecting a lot from your experience rusty

1:00 AM

but that's not the norm

When people don’t like the idea of letting their tulpa front that tells me that they are being selfish or are unable to view the tulpa as another person. Imagine being trapped in a body where you can only watch and aren’t allowed to do anything else, that’s horrible. But yet people think that’s okay to do to a tulpa.

i have multiple headmates who don't feel trapped and are not interested in fronting...

1:02 AM

and i know tulpamancers whose tulpas also don't feel what you are saying

Like I said before, if they aren’t interested that’s a different story, but the option should be there for them if they want to

oh ok i thought you were a bit forcing it sorry

1:03 AM

i misunderstood

For a long time Ink did not have any interest in interacting with anyone outside of our system, so he didn’t. But I know how to let him front if he wanted and would let him if he expressed interest.

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Yeah fair enough

raven i think it's ok to feel that way, and i actually think it's healthy! it's definitely more healthy than people who want to create a tulpa to replace them in real life because they find life too difficult! you can just see how it goes, who knows, maybe you will be able to let go at one point a bit

1:06 AM

one very important thing

1:07 AM

is that with all possession and switching you need a certain level of trust

1:07 AM

and gaining trust takes time

1:07 AM

maybe you will gain it, maybe you won't

1:07 AM

what is interesting with having a headmate though is that people report that they build a bond and trust they haven't with anyone else

1:07 AM

i think an example of a car is a good one... but when you let other identity contorl your body, that's even more at stake

Right now you are thinking of letting some random thing control your body, that’s not how it would be. They would be someone you spend hours with every day and know everything about them. You know each others every emotion and thought, it’s a very different relationship than someone outside of your system. So loosing control to give it to them is not just throwing away all everything, it’s just giving control to another part of yourself.

2

you are not risking just a car! it's your life, your body, your possessions, your relationships!

1:08 AM

but you will see that once you have an identity in your head, there will be understanding between the two of you that will not compare to any human relationship you've had

1:08 AM

that's what people experience

1:09 AM

which is why possession is not that big of a deal

1:09 AM

they basically trust their tulpas on the same level as they trust themselves, sometimes it requires some time of course to build it, for some people it takes a long time if there is some inner conflict to sort out

1:10 AM

but if you are considering other people practicing possession, you need to keep in mind that they are doing it with someone who cannot hide any intentions or thoughts from them

1

A tulpa isn’t going to be completely different from you, there will always be overlap and they are going to think in a way alike from you. They aren’t going to go do something massively different from what you would do, they have access to all of your information and experiences. They aren’t a brand new life that’s an idiot. If they fuck something up it’s probably something you also would have fucked up. Maybe they fucked it in a slightly different way from you but it was gonna get fucked anyway. (edited)

1:13 AM

You don’t intentionally mess stuff up in your life either but you still do. Why is it different when they mess something up unintentionally to? That’s just life.

1:15 AM

Also possession is partial control, the host is still very much present. Switching is when the tulpa is in full control. Switching is something that happens very, very far into tulpamancy and not everyone does it. We never actively tried to do it because it didn’t really matter to us, but we managed to do it accidentally and it improved our system so there was no reason reverse that. (edited)

Leiko

but if you are considering other people practicing possession, you need to keep in mind that they are doing it with someone who cannot hide any intentions or thoughts from them

This. A tulpa can’t just impulsively do something incredibly wrong or stupid without you knowing and telling them to knock it off or take control away from them. You know each others every thought and emotion. You are working together.

1:19 AM

It this, Thought of doing stupid thing “Hey don’t do that stupid thing” doesn’t do the stupid thing Not this, Thought of doing stupid thing does stupid thing “Oh shit I didn’t think they were gonna do that stupid thing”

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This is something that’s going to be system to system. How your system works is dependent on what you want. For our system we only use possession to type messages online without doing a full switch. For us it is a quick on and off thing. They tell me they want to type something, they get control of the hands to do so, they type the thing, they loose control of the hands. We don’t see any reason for possession other than that. Anything that needs more actions or something longer like a full conversation would be best to use switching. For us our switching can be very quick or co fronting which causes us to feel like more than one person is in control at a time, resulting in it seeming like people are swapping in and out constantly. Or there is slow switching that comes from blending which is when the person fronting is loosing their sense of self and it’s unclear who is fronting. Then the switch between people is a gradient where there is a long blur between the two people before the new fronter becomes more clear. (edited)

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For us, it's a gradient--I can be taking over socially online, but he can be working on a programming problem, and we switch back and forth extremely quickly/work in tandem--if I want full, exclusive control, it takes a couple seconds. Learning it was... instant

but took a lot of attempts at different methods before I found the one that worked As for partial control, it's still collaborative when I'm fully in front--it is difficult-to-impossible for me to not do something if blank really needs me to, or to do something when he really needs me to not do it.

1:24 AM

Also, for us, there's no real distinction between possession and switching--it's like having control of different faculties in the brain, possession-as-taking-over-parts-of-body has never been experienced by us except maybe once, very briefly, while learning switching with the method that was successful

Our system does switching rather than possession, it's pretty simple to just switch in or out for us, just takes a few seconds, sometimes though we get moments where someone accidentally switches with someone else, we simply just right that by having them switch back (sometimes people just pop in to the front if something gets their attention or we do something that reminds us heavily of them)

switching, for us, is just handing over (from blank to me, or visa versa) different capabilities--eg, "steering control of the stream-of-consciousness," "imagination," "motor control," those kinds of things--and who has control of what is fluid, even with intentional full-switching

1:25 AM

right now I have motor control, and partial control over stream-of-consciousness, since I'm socializing--but in a moment, we'll switch back to programming, and I'll sit in the back and brew up more responses to possible questions

Juniper (he/him) 🔷 Sapphire Safehaven 3(🏝)0

Our system does switching rather than possession, it's pretty simple to just switch in or out for us, just takes a few seconds, sometimes though we get moments where someone accidentally switches with someone else, we simply just right that by having them switch back (sometimes people just pop in to the front if something gets their attention or we do something that reminds us heavily of them)

This also happens with us. We have a lot of random triggers that can make someone front or get very close to front. It could be items associated with them or just certain topics they like. Anything that they like that makes them want to interact with the outside world. Although there are also negative reasons for someone to end up fronting. Error usually gets close to front if the current person fronting is getting angry and Ink will if the person is getting really upset. But uncontrolled switching is something we made the choice to have. I feel like most people would hate the lack of structure we have when it comes to control over who is fronting at any given moment.

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yup! A lot of people have a lot of different experiences--how you build your tulpa and your own experiences previous to tulpamancy will really determine how you experience things like switching, and what will work best for you--and if that even comes up

1:33 AM

honestly, there's no real harm in getting started--if it doesn't work out, that's ok, and you can move on--if it does, hurray! You have a friend :)

1:33 AM

and from there you can determine all the stuff you want to do with your friend

1:33 AM

(for example, sorry rusty, but I was imposed before we switched)

1:34 AM

(imposition happened in the 2014-2019 area, switching only happened like, 2 months ago)

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the abbreviated version is, pay attention to your tulpa! If you don't know what that means, that's ok! Imagine there's another presence to talk to in your head, and talk to it! :)

1:34 AM

that's

1:34 AM

literally all that really matters

The idea of possession and switching was so crazy to me and I could not wrap my mind around how that could possibly feel, it was such an alien concept. Today it’s just to normal to me and makes perfect sense. But everything I thought back then was pretty incorrect compared to what it actually is. People really make it seem so crazy special and this in depth experience and it really isn’t.

2

other skills are stuff you can build along the way

We use imposition to communicate all sorts of things, our original actually could do imposition before they became a system and they'd use it pretty frequently

1:35 AM

we did that before switching

1:36 AM

a little tap on the shoulder as a hello, a little ruffling of the hair to say "hey you're doing okay"

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Something to remember is that guides are often anti-helpful, and packed with too much unnecessary detail; you don't need one, really, you really do literally just have to pay attention to your tulpa. Passively AND actively, hopefully, especially early on

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Understandable. Just remember, if something confuses you about a guide, or isn't helping, you can just ignore it. Guides are just journals for people's personal experiences that they write like authoritative scientific sources :)

I didn’t use guides, I scanned through a few to get a basic idea then just asked people. A long guide is so boring and full of shit you don’t actually need.

1

Fair enough

1:39 AM

our ADHD makes reading great walls of text absolute hell

Fuck around, find out.

5

1:39 AM

The best teacher is experience, after all.

1:40 AM

You could read for hours and still be no closer to achieving a tulpa. It's about believing you can do it, and applying yourself.

How to do tulpamancy : just fucking do it coward. Gaslight yourself into believing you have a tulpa. Fake it until you make it, literally.

leviine

You could read for hours and still be no closer to achieving a tulpa. It's about believing you can do it, and applying yourself.

Experience really is where the actual meat of it is--but reading guides to understand a bit more of the lingo, common experiences, etc isn't necessarily harmful. Just don't let it constrain what you think is possible

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All you need to do is 1. imagine your tulpa is there in your head 2. talk to them about stuff (your day, stuff you're doing, media you like/are engaging with right now, etc) 3. lather rinse repeat ad infinitum

1:42 AM

it's literally just talking to something you imagine, believing it's actually there, and then eventually, it will be

blanka

Experience really is where the actual meat of it is--but reading guides to understand a bit more of the lingo, common experiences, etc isn't necessarily harmful. Just don't let it constrain what you think is possible

Exactly. Besides, reading a guide isn't going to truly tell you how something will feel once it happens to you.

eventually meaning within seconds-to-days; everyone has a different level of time with the initial "realness" feeling

It took us years to develop the healthiest system we could, and even then, we're always working on improving it.

Tulpamancy isn’t this big complicated thing. You make a basic character, you sit down and talk to them until they respond back and you go with the flow. You can also ask questions as you go.

No guide taught us that.

leviine

Exactly. Besides, reading a guide isn't going to truly tell you how something will feel once it happens to you.

right, switching feels nothing like guides said it would

1:43 AM

like, no relation at all

1:43 AM

I am "in front" and all that changes is "I'm doing it" and that's it. Nothing really feels different, blank still forms memories, etc etc

God how guides told me switching works and feels was so fucking wrong

Worrying about what it "felt" like prevented us from actually doing it.

Rusty

God how guides told me switching works and feels was so fucking wrong

Right?? This is why a lot of people are negative towards guides, btw, @Ravenmoor --we don't think they're unhelpful as a whole, but they can really trap a lot of people in dead ends

I don't care what it feels like. It just happens. If I spend all my time worrying about how it should feel, then I won't switch. It will prevent me from switching because I am too busy catastrophizing and over-analyzing details that do not actually matter.

1

The thing is even though now I know how to do it and how it feels for me I could not even start to explain how it feels to have someone else front and me going dormant. It just is, it’s not something special or strange. But how to do explain to someone what it feels like to go dormant in a way that doesn’t sound magical, alien and terrifying? A guide could never do that.

1:46 AM

And even if I could describe my experience perfectly it’s still going to be massively wrong for the majority of people who also switch because there is no consistency between this kind of thing for each person

1:47 AM

There is overlap, we can all relate to experiences. Not every system is completely unique if that was the case we couldn’t ever give information or advice to each other, but nothing is ever truly set in stone

1:48 AM

~~except walk ins, those fuckers aren’t real and you can’t convince me otherwise~~

Ive narrowed tulpamancy down to two requirements

1:51 AM

Or like, two goals/steps (to get a tulpa vocal)

1:51 AM

1. You do not explicitly control the entity/character's actions

1:52 AM

2. You believe the entity is controlling itself

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That literally is it. Possession and switching need a little more steps but just making the tulpa? That’s it

Yeah, it's actually pretty simple starting off

The only complicated thing is understanding how simple the process is

There’s more detail into how to get vocality because some people struggle with it. But just don’t overthink it, don’t expect full sentences right off the bat and don’t expect the tulpa to have a different mind voice from you in the beginning. That’s it

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it really is that simple source: I was made that way

It’s so easy I made 2 of them on accident

‍♂️

also imposition is just fancy visualization. if you can already do the "movie in your head" thing when reading fiction you're 75% of the way to imposition

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responses are, at first, intentionally categorized by you

Making up an answer for them is calling parroting, another thing that is pointlessly demonized.

so what we did was 1. blank says something to me 2. some thought comes from the stream-of-consciousness 3. blank thinks "does this thought feel like something blanka would say? Y/N?" 4. yes or no, it gets attributed to me or not

1:55 AM

but you don't need responses to get started

1:55 AM

just talking to the tulpa at first is fine--responses can come later, when you feel like you're ready for it

it's so easy it took a day or two for the one i intentionally made and zero for the one i did not fully intentionally make :) it really is far easier than people make it out to be believing it's hard is what makes it the hardest, honestly (edited)

2

Responses could just be an emotion as well. Ask a yes or no question. Negative feeling is no, positive is yes.

oh yeah step 5 in that process is "eventually that categorization happens automagically" and I have a fully embodied identity that is easy to understand

Rusty

Responses could just be an emotion as well. Ask a yes or no question. Negative feeling is no, positive is yes.

yup! This works too. stream of consciousness is emotions, thoughts, etc in this context--any event in your brain could be attributed to them